Whoops, i meant sampling error, not statistical error in my previous post.

Another finding, confirmed in two separate studies at the time of publication of Life At Death: People more knowledgeable in NDE's beforehand were less likely to have recalled one. Weird. No idea what that might mean, if anything. These are the sort of things that would nag my belief in this subject. One thing Dr. Ring brought up which could account for these things is statistical error. This could apply to my previous post, but I'm not so sure on this one considering the repeatability of the finding.

One statistic that has cropped up in Kennith Ring's study was the percentage of incidence in the core experience between men and women. Men are more likely to have such an experience as a result of an accident, whereas women have a higher incidence due to illness. It's given me some pause for thought as I didn't expect there to be such a difference at all. Two things come to mind.

1) The difference in brain chemistry between men and women.
I don't think this should be ignored as a possible factor in any differences between the sexes when it comes to anything in psychology and perhaps the NDE by proxy.

2) From a statistical (and could I forward, evolutionary) standpoint - men are more likely to die prematurely due to an accident than women.
I know, but I just cant let go of the evolution thing. It still seems to me to be a possible factor in this phenomenon. Personally I feel the point above is a pertinent one. Especially if you wind back the clock to the days of constant war, feuding, and the day to day dangers of hunting and gathering.

I just think if you think about this in pure biological terms, then it would be almost certain that you'd find differences between men and women.

I've all but finished the book now, Dr Ring is comparing his findings with other research - to a high degree of agreement too. Cheers for putting me onto that book, I think anyone with an interest in this topic would do well to read it. I remain undecided though; probably always will. But I will admit that overall, I have lost confidence in a purely last gasp scenario. Some evolutionary scenario is probably a stronger argument in my mind, but of course, how this might work in detail continues to elude me. I wonder if there's a common 'circuit' in our heads that links to our memories and this circuit is somehow stimulated in near death situations, leading to aspects of the core experience. But there are problems with this, quite a few.

Don't know fuzoid, guess I'll have to wait and see. Perhaps future research might reveal something more for us to go on. Perhaps this Susan Blackmore's current study will yield patients who actually recall the pictures on the shelving in resuscitation rooms. If that were to happen, I think I might just have to believe in this. Should hear back on that in another two years or less.

cheers

[quote="devil666"]
Hi ddd, I'm sorry to butt in on your post to fuzoid. I just wanted to say i see you in a different light now after reading your post on nde. I always took you as a hardened skeptic for this i apologize. Have a good new year, all the best :)[/quote]

Well....i am a hardened skeptic, but as I told you a while back, I do keep somewhat of an open mind. There have been many scientific studies into this phenomenon, my Granddad had a core experience. The experiences resemble each other too much for me to put them away. And they make too much logical sense for me to see how brains in trauma, if functioning at all to our knowledge, could have created them in a last gasp as they were being starved of oxygen. I just don't see it anymore.

Though, fuzoid had to poke and prod a bit before I began to consider it like that. lol
Its possible to be too skeptical, just as it is possible to be too open minded.

So yeah, I am a hardened skeptic, most of the time it's warranted - but not always. ;)

[quote="ddd"]Howdy fuzoid, as promised I've brought Life At Death back with me. Didn't really get the chance to see what dad thought of it, I'll have to ask him. I'm in the middle of "qualitative aspects of the NDE" atm.

One thing that's come to the for, and I'm not sure if we mentioned it in our conversation now, is how vivid and logical the overwhelming majority of these cases are.

At the start I offered the last gasp theory, but that term doesn't really describe the calm and rational order of the experience. If it's the product of a brain that understands it is about to die, or is firing away in a last gasp of activity, then why would the experience be - almost universally - an ordered one of the utmost peace and calm?

Also, we only dream when we are in a relatively light sleep, and 99% of these dreams are disordered nonsense. And yet, people who are flat out on the edge of death, deeply unconscious, way further down than a deep slumber - shutting down even, can have these experiences that are so vivid and realistic, calm and logical.

This topic will probably always be an open one on my mind for this reason if not any other. Anyways, as things come up in this book, I'll drop a line, bounce my thoughts off you.

Happy new year if I don't here from you beforehand.
cheers.[/quote]
Hi ddd, I'm sorry to butt in on your post to fuzoid. I just wanted to say i see you in a different light now after reading your post on nde. I always took you as a hardened skeptic for this i apologize. Have a good new year, all the best :)

[quote="fuzoid"][quote="ddd"]I thought I'd add this link I found:

[url]http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/09/18/2368340.htm?section=justin[/url]

When I first started talking with you on this topic I mentioned a recent news story I'd seen about a new study into NDE's. I'm guessing they are searching the last minutes of brain activity in cardiac patients. Also, they will be installing shelving in resuscitation rooms with pictures that can only be seen from the ceiling. Worth a shot I think. It's being done in the U.K. and the U.S.[/quote]

I'm quite familiar with experiment. It was first proposed by Dr. Susan Blackmore.[/quote]
Yes, this is true the UK hospital is in South Hampton, I know this because i am still gathering information and evidence to back up my claims. Upon reaching the switch board i was directed by an american to a web site called gather, who sponsored the whole thing. It was a meeting place where i posted my experience and then left as this would not help my cause.

Howdy fuzoid, as promised I've brought Life At Death back with me. Didn't really get the chance to see what dad thought of it, I'll have to ask him. I'm in the middle of "qualitative aspects of the NDE" atm.

One thing that's come to the for, and I'm not sure if we mentioned it in our conversation now, is how vivid and logical the overwhelming majority of these cases are.

At the start I offered the last gasp theory, but that term doesn't really describe the calm and rational order of the experience. If it's the product of a brain that understands it is about to die, or is firing away in a last gasp of activity, then why would the experience be - almost universally - an ordered one of the utmost peace and calm?

Also, we only dream when we are in a relatively light sleep, and 99% of these dreams are disordered nonsense. And yet, people who are flat out on the edge of death, deeply unconscious, way further down than a deep slumber - shutting down even, can have these experiences that are so vivid and realistic, calm and logical.

This topic will probably always be an open one on my mind for this reason if not any other. Anyways, as things come up in this book, I'll drop a line, bounce my thoughts off you.

Happy new year if I don't here from you beforehand.
cheers.

[quote="Jaime.Colombani"]I had a N.D.E. I won't talk about it publicly because I won't have it tivialized. Also I've had N.D.E.s in my sleep, I've actually died in my sleep, fought demons in my sleep, went through the 'rapture' in my sleep, fought the devil and his minions during that rapture, fell asleep in my dreams, died in my dreams, went to hell in my dream, and fall off cliffs and high points and actually hit the ground. I don't wake before I hit, I wake on the bounce, it hurts sometimes. Oh yeah, once I was the born anti-Christ in my dream! Had a red star over my position on the planet and everything.

So, if these things interest anyone they may contact me via myspace, or if your registered, my email on this site.

My myspace is: [url]htttp://www.myspace.com/Jaime_Hyme[/url]

Thank you. PS any judgement upon me will be returned 3 fold by The Lord![/quote]

Far be it for me to question your experiences. However, I do need to ask, have you ever been declared clinically dead? If not, then none of what you experienced was an NDE. They would have all been dreams. The reason I question whether you actually had an NDE is because the majority do not associate any type of religion with their experience. Non-judgemental spirituality, yes. But no religion. And according to your above description and MySpace page, you are Christian. This in no way demeans any of your dreams. But according to all the literature I've read on the subject, your expectations will influence your experience up to the point of the core experience. And since you obviously have very profound Christian beliefs, it is these beliefs that have influenced your dreams. My advice for whatever it's worth? Do not focus on the negative aspects of your faith as this is what you will experience. Try focusing more on the light and love of God. Focus on the positive and your dreams will change.

Do you mind if I ask what type of church do you attend? During my Christian days, I was a member of a full Gospel charismatic church. Although I really liked the majority of the people that attended, this church always focused on the negative. Meaning the devil (who I no longer believe in), hell, the evils of society, the evils of those who did not believe as they did, etc... So rather than seeing the inherent goodness of people, all they saw were sinners and focued on that. Their outlook was negative and fearful and they failed to recognize they were creating their own hell. Instead they should have been focusing on the positive and helping the community with no expectations of anything in return. It was their religious fear that held them back.

I noticed you make no mention of entering a realm of light and being met by loved ones or a spiritual guide. This alone tells me you may not have experienced an NDE.

You have quite the eclectic taste in music. If you're up to it, check out the music of Neal Morse. He's a co-founder of the progressive rock band, Spock's Beard, but eventually went it alone after becoming a Christian. Although his music style has not changed, his message has. Although I no longer agree with the message, the music is top notch done in the style of Spock's Beard. Enjoy!

fuzoid
[url]http://www.liv365.com/stations/fuzoid[/url]

[quote]any judgement upon me will be returned 3 fold by The Lord![/quote]
What does this mean? Does it mean don't insult you? I can't help making judgements, although I don't have to share them, and I don't have to proceed as if they are accurate.

I had a N.D.E. I won't talk about it publicly because I won't have it tivialized. Also I've had N.D.E.s in my sleep, I've actually died in my sleep, fought demons in my sleep, went through the 'rapture' in my sleep, fought the devil and his minions during that rapture, fell asleep in my dreams, died in my dreams, went to hell in my dream, and fall off cliffs and high points and actually hit the ground. I don't wake before I hit, I wake on the bounce, it hurts sometimes. Oh yeah, once I was the born anti-Christ in my dream! Had a red star over my position on the planet and everything.

So, if these things interest anyone they may contact me via myspace, or if your registered, my email on this site.

My myspace is: [url]htttp://www.myspace.com/Jaime_Hyme[/url]

Thank you. PS any judgement upon me will be returned 3 fold by The Lord!