to devil666-strange that you say there is a real devil! The biggest bill of goods sold to supposedly intelligent people is that there is no God and that present life originated from one simple cell and evolved through a process of natural selection to its present form. I submit that this hypothesis is not only unfounded, unscientific, and untenable, but that it is also, based on all known and established laws, impossible! Moreover,I suggest that when man denies God, man becomes a fool. Romans 1:21-22 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools. Where are these Grave Errors you speak of? I would like to take a look at them.

"Question #8: What is the oldest dinosaur ever found?

EoraptorAnswer: Recent prosauropods from Madagascar are the oldest, about 230 million years old."
http://www.enchantedlearning.com/subjects/dinosaurs/questions/faq/Oldest.shtml


Dinosaurs =/= first life, by any means. Dinosaurs certainly weren't around when the earth was relatively young.

Having been in 2 Christian schools and then actually being able to learn things on my own with an open mind, I asked this question a lot. After looking at a lot of things on the internet, I found this 1 video that actually showed the planets all connected and in the video, it explained a few good theories that i thought were more probable to have happened then we are lead to believe. One thing it mentioned was that the Earth expanded in size which caused the continents to become further apart. Why Not? Isn't it better to believe this then the evolutional beliefs that all our DNA just magically came together from a mudhole? Most religions have their followers believing their God created everything and for the most part, i believe this is true. After actually doing all the research possible for 3 years to get to the truth of the different religions, "When" they first formed and "Who" actually formed them, I'm at a point now where I believe in a consciences universe and all things are somehow connected. This could also be the cause for more or stronger solar flares, ice shelfs melting etc..

The Physicists have been saying that different objects, (atoms, molecules, etc.) are seemingly non-existent unless observed. They are actually at a point where too many that were non-believers in a higher conscientiousness have proven to themselves that what they thought they knew before was completely wrong. This has/had them trying to find out even more about the things we can not see but do exist.

It's a never-ending argument and because too many people put their faith and trust in someone else without actually looking into it's origin. Of course, i should probably say also, too many people do not use common sense with their beliefs.

Carbon dating has been proven to be wrong or off is even the ash from a cigarette were to contaminate the sample to be dated or the oils from out skin so trying to come up with a date of origin for anything without having and knowing the actual date of the first and oldest thing in the universe would be impossible, in my opinion.

We're all humans and it's just our nature to look for answers to many questions but i think it's wrong to just accept all the answers we are lead to believe just to follow society's comfort.

For example, Lets take the God from the King James version of this particular Bible. If God created the Heavens and the Earth, the waters and all the living things on the Earth, why would he need money? Why would a God who can do anything at all, need us to give 10% of our earnings to the Churches? Could it be that the Vatican does actually have more money then God himself? After all, the Vatican does have an armored car he drives around in. Does he not trust in God to protect him and keep him safe? Granted, I switched religions in mainstream here without warning but the point is still clear, i hope.

Back to the King James version for another example - Throughout the Bible, we are "taught" the 10 commandments, what is right and wrong and how we should live. We are told specifically, and i think, pretty clear, that homosexuals ie gays, lesbians etc., are to be taken to the edge of town and stoned to death but that goes against the Commandment, Thou Shalt Not Kill.

I just think the whole religious thing is for us humans to use as guidelines more then anything else. It's been said, in the Bible, something to the effect that if anyone believes, and commands a mountain to be moved, it shall be moved. again, this isn't a direct quote from the Bible but generally speaking, it's accurate. So i have no choice but to believe that there hasn't been a single real believer since those words were spoken or we are not "enlightened" enough during this age of Pisces and until we actually go through a lot of tribulations into the age of Aquarius that just happens to begin at the end of 2012 I think it is? (subject to being incorrect within a reasonable amount of time)

I will never try to convince anyone to believe this or that, I'm just me and my thoughts and beliefs are my own personal thoughts and beliefs that i have come to the conclusions to by doing my own research.

It was just in the news a few days ago http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com/sciencetech/men-no-longer-necessary-for-sperm-production/750 that mankind can create a clone without the semen from a man and without an egg from a woman so would that make the scientists God of their creation? Not that i believe!

Friend wrote:to Fool- I would say that the dinosaurs would be part of the first earth age, since they are not here with us in the second earth age. That would be a great way to put it.

No, that is not a great way to put it. You're using ages as a tool to measure time yet you only have a timeline for your so-called second age. This is not very scientific or valid.

What is the oldest fossil remains of a dinosaurs?

Approximately 227 million years. And they died off around 65 million years ago. So we know that dinosaurs have been around a minimum of 162 million years. But it's more likely at 250 million or higher. That's one helluva long age! And the second is only 6,000 years? Your god is not very consistent.

I am sure you might know this, for i do not, I do not know the different species of prehistoric creatures and when they lived,(how long ago) can you help with this?

If you do not know the answer to any of this, how can you make a claim for ages? How can you claim Job speaks of dinosaurs? I suggest you educate yourself with REAL science before making claims about pseudoscience.

Friend wrote:to devil666-strange that you say there is a real devil!

You interpreted his comment as claiming there really is a devil? No wonder you seem to be having problems with the bible.

The biggest bill of goods sold to supposedly intelligent people is that there is no God...

Really? Do you have a receipt for this bill of goods? Because intelligent people recognize and follow real science. And real science has nothing to say about god! In other words, most who have no belief one way or the other are usually neutral. That's the only intelligent position to take. Unless you have proof?

...and that present life originated from one simple cell and evolved through a process of natural selection to its present form.

And you have a better answer? Oh, that's right, God snapped His/Hers/Its finger and poof, there was Adam. But lo and behold, Adam was lonely and horny, so god gave Adam a few valiums which put him to sleep. When god saw Adam was sleeping, he stole one of his ribs and created Eve, the temptress.

Sorry, I'll stick with evolution, thank you. BTW, I stumbled across a site you might find interesting. Personally I rank it as B.S., but it does show that some of your fellow liars for Jesus do believe in evolution. Here's the link: http://www.jesusbelievesinevolution.com/

I submit that this hypothesis is not only unfounded, unscientific, and untenable, but that it is also, based on all known and established laws, impossible!

Since you're making an [un]scientific claim, support it.

Moreover,I suggest that when man denies God, man becomes a fool.

Why would a god care whether or not people believe in him/her/it? Does your god have an inferiority complex?

Romans 1:21-22 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools.

Quoting scripture is supposed to make it true?

Where are these Grave Errors you speak of? I would like to take a look at them.

Are you sure about this? Are you absolutely sure you want to hear about the errors in the bible? Answer this before I will post them. Because once I do, there is no going back. BTW, ironically, one of them is a grave error.

to Fuzoid:The bible is not a scientific book, yet it is scientifically accurate. I am not aware of any scientific evidence that contradicts the bible. As for dinosaurs and the bible- The Bible refers to many common animals we know today. The list includes lions,wolves,bears,sheep,cattle, and dogs along with various kinds of birds,rodents,reptiles,and insects. What is interesting is that this extensive list includes three animals that we no longer recognize are (in the hebrew languge) Tanniyn, B@hemowth (yes, it is spelled correctly-at least as close as we can get in the roman characters), and Livyathan. Statements Consistent with Paleontology: Dinosaurs are referred to in several Bible books. The book of Job describes two dinosaurs. One is described in chapter 40 starting at verse 15, and the other chapter 41 starting at verse 1. We think that you will agree that 1.5 chapters about dinosaurs is a lot-since most people do not realize that they are mentioned in the bible! DINOSAURS NAMES, THEN AND NOW! Name and date first written in the bible- Tanniyn, before 1400bc, Behemoth,before1400bc, Leviathan, before 1400bc! SCIENTIFIC NAMES AND DATES the name appeared- DINOSAURS, 1841ad, BRACHIOSAURUS, 1903ad, KRONOSAURUS,1901ad.
Behemoth described in Job 40:15-24, Leviathan described in Job 41, Psalms 104:25, 26, and Isaiah 27:1.
Tanniyn occurs 28 times in the Bible and is normally translated "dragon". I is also translated "serpent", "sea monster", "dinosaurs", "great creature", and "reptile".
1. Statements consistent with astronomy: The Bible frequently refers to the great number of stars in the heavens. Genesis 22:17, Jeremiah 33:22. The Bible also says that each star is unique. 1 Corinthians 15:41. The Bible describes the suspension of the earth in space. Job 26:7.
2. Statements consistent with meteorology: The Bible describes the circulation of the atmosphere. Ecclesiastes 1:6. The Bible includes some principles of fluid dynamics. Job 28:25. These are just a few examples of how science and the bible prove each other, I could go on and on but you just ask for one, As far as judging some one i was just calling him what he wanted to be referred too as, devil666! If he said he was Mr Johnson, I would say Mr Johnson, Either way God knew him before he was in his mothers womb! It was not meant for some people to be preachers, I know it is best that i am not! If you say you believe in God i believe you. You appear to be very intelligent, more so than myself! I just can't see things any different than what Gods word says....

this post is to bible nut: Redfox007 who posted on» Mon May 25, 2009 4:04 pm

I'm not sure what Newer Time Research you've been looking at but the research I've been looking at is called radioactive half-life, and it's found in the carbon of fossils, like that one you said was 7000 years old, and it says your full of sh*t!

Half-Life dating, if you're not familiar, is mathematical. Every so many years, half of the radiation in carbon disappears, about every 5,000 years or so. And by looking at current living tissue we are able to obtain the living amount of radiation, so half of half of half of half etc... goes back 4.7 Billion years. Also, there is another form of carbon dating that you are probably not aware of, it is where they burn away carbon known to be a certain date, then they compare that to the carbon of early material and make a ratio between of the two, the time it takes the carbon to burn at a certain temperature will indicate how old it is... instead of looking in the bible for all your answers perhaps you should divert your eyes to a more modern book, I'm not saying the bible is a bad book, it's not, in fact.. it's a great fiction, just like lord of the rings, but i wouldn't ask froto when the earth was created.

Carbon 14 dating is not accurate over billions of years. I think a few hundred thousand at the most?
Anyway, the same principle is used with many other different dating methods that do go back billions of years.

fuzoid: go ahead, knock your self out ! I need to see a real intelligent explanation of ........? The Bible?

Perhaps I was a little too hard on you in my responses. Your response seems sincere so I will respond accordingly.

Friend wrote:to Fuzoid:The bible is not a scientific book, yet it is scientifically accurate.

I don’t know how else to respond other than, no, it is not. In fact, not even close.

I am not aware of any scientific evidence that contradicts the bible.

Then you need to start at the beginning, Genesis. It’s lack of scientific accuracy is staring at you in black and white. If you still fail to see what I’m talking about, ask and I’ll explain it.

As for dinosaurs and the bible- The Bible refers to many common animals we know today. The list includes lions,wolves,bears,sheep,cattle, and dogs along with various kinds of birds,rodents,reptiles,and insects. What is interesting is that this extensive list includes three animals that we no longer recognize are (in the hebrew languge) Tanniyn, B@hemowth (yes, it is spelled correctly-at least as close as we can get in the roman characters), and Livyathan.

I’m curious where you’re getting your spelling for behemoth and tanniyn from because I can’t locate either in my copy of the Strong’s Exhaustive Concordance? Anyway, just because we do not recognize what animals are being described does not mean they are dinosaurs. Actually, not even your fellow Christians believe they are referring to dinosaurs. If you check the footnotes, you will note that they believe the behemoth is either an elephant or hippo and that the leviathan is a crocodile. And since I have no idea what a tanniyn is referring to, nor can I locate it in the bible or the Strong’s, I can’t tell you what it is. If I were to pronounce it the way it’s spelled, it would sound identical to tannin, a word that is commonly used in the language of wine. Where in the bible do you find tanniyn?

Statements Consistent with Paleontology: Dinosaurs are referred to in several Bible books. The book of Job describes two dinosaurs. One is described in chapter 40 starting at verse 15, and the other chapter 41 starting at verse 1.

No, Job does not reference dinosaurs. See above.

We think that you will agree that 1.5 chapters about dinosaurs is a lot-since most people do not realize that they are mentioned in the bible!

No, I do not agree nor are they mentioned in the bible. See above. BTW, who are we?

DINOSAURS NAMES, THEN AND NOW! Name and date first written in the bible- Tanniyn, before 1400bc, Behemoth,before1400bc, Leviathan, before 1400bc!

None of these are names for dinosaurs, nor do they refer to dinosaurs.

SCIENTIFIC NAMES AND DATES the name appeared- DINOSAURS, 1841ad, BRACHIOSAURUS, 1903ad, KRONOSAURUS,1901ad.

This is supposed to prove the bible?

Behemoth described in Job 40:15-24, Leviathan described in Job 41, Psalms 104:25, 26, and Isaiah 27:1.
Tanniyn occurs 28 times in the Bible and is normally translated "dragon". I is also translated "serpent", "sea monster", "dinosaurs", "great creature", and "reptile".

Once again, none of these are describing dinosaurs. It’s quite possible there was a marine dinosaur hold out from 65 million years ago, as legends of the Loch Ness Monster and the Lake Champaign Monster attest to. But there were no land dinosaurs. And after decades of searching, neither Nessie or Champ have ever been found.

BTW, it’s not necessary to tell me where you found tanniyn in the bible, because you didn’t. You lifted it from http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/dinos.shtml. And since this site claims tanniyn is mentioned 28 times in the bible, why do they not tell us where in the bible? Because I still can’t find the word. Nor does it appear in either the Hebrew or Greek lexicons.

Here’s a suggestion. Whenever you reference material from a source that is not your own, cite your source. Because someone such as me will go searching for information and eventually we will discover your source.

1. Statements consistent with astronomy: The Bible frequently refers to the great number of stars in the heavens. Genesis 22:17, Jeremiah 33:22. The Bible also says that each star is unique.

This is not astronomy. In fact, not even close! Anyone with eyes can look up and see a “great number of stars in the heavens.” So this proves nothing. And why wouldn’t each star be unique? Each star is its own star and no other. So each star can’t be anything but unique! BTW, the bible speaks of these stars in the firmament, which was also described as the heavens. Where is this firmament?

1 Corinthians 15:41. The Bible describes the suspension of the earth in space. Job 26:7.

Suspended by what? And where is it supposed to be suspended from? This is about as scientific as the earth resting on the back of a turtle.

2. Statements consistent with meteorology: The Bible describes the circulation of the atmosphere. Ecclesiastes 1:6.

Allow me to ask, do you feel a breeze on windy days? Now, how is this supposed to prove the bible? BTW, this does not describe the atmosphere circulating. It states, “He imparted weight to the wind.” The weight, or rather pressure, is what you feel on your face.

The Bible includes some principles of fluid dynamics. Job 28:25.

It does not describe fluid dynamics. It specifically states, “And meted out the waters by measure,” In other words, it is describing your god as measuring out and distributing the water. There is absolutely no reference to fluid dynamics. You do understand what fluid dynamics is, don’t you?

These are just a few examples of how science and the bible prove each other,

And not a single thing you provided is science nor does any of it prove the bible.

I could go on and on but you just ask for one,

Please do go on because I would really like to see how science proves the bible.

As far as judging some one i was just calling him what he wanted to be referred too as, devil666! If he said he was Mr Johnson, I would say Mr Johnson,

Uh, no, you called him a fool. In other words, due to your father’s advice, you judged him to be a fool.

Either way God knew him before he was in his mothers womb!

I have no problem with this statement. But if it were me, I would take it a step further and say God knew him for an eternity and before all his other physical births. Yes, I am implying reincarnation, which Jesus believed in if some interpretations are to be taken seriously.

It was not meant for some people to be preachers, I know it is best that i am not!

Understood. It’s also best that you don’t try to use other people’s pseudoscience to try to prove the bible as well.

If you say you believe in God i believe you.

Which is a very good thing too, because I do. But it is not your god.

You appear to be very intelligent, more so than myself!

I wasn’t born with this knowledge, I learned it. And ironically it was my Christian fundamentalist days that actually placed me on the path I’m on now!

I just can't see things any different than what Gods word says....

No one is asking you to. But if there is something that contradicts what you believe to be god’s word, don’t you think it deserves looking into? This is how I ended up on the path I’m on. And I’m thankful for it because it has forced me to educate myself and has opened my eyes to so much more than I would have otherwise. Religions tend to be too restrictive and narrow minded and when something comes along that contradicts their religious sensibilities, they come up with pseudoscience to explain it away. And that’s exactly what this site you quoted from has done.

Just a friendly piece of advice, do not get so bogged down in dogma that you are blinded to the facts of science. Because once bogged down, you become entrenched. And once entrenched, you will fight scientific fact every step of the way.

fuzoid
http://www.live365.com/stations/fuzoid